Hi all

Nothing at all from the "search" function.

Another forum I'm on is having a raging debate about whether dubbin (tallow, wax, oil mixture) rots stitching in leathers. Scientific theories have been supplied as to how it happens in the laboratory and research papers have been produced to demonstrate this. The opponents to the arguement assert that they are only interested in "real life" examples.

So, I thought I'd ask you folks. Does anyone have a real life, everyday experience of dubbin rotting the stitching of your leathers?

Is "dubbin" a brand name???

 

No not if you use it correctly, This stuff was made for horse riding saddles and gear,primarily to coat the stitches so they are protected from water,without this the stitching becomes weak from constant wet & dry cycles, must use saddle soap to first clean and the apply very thin layer of Dubbin and work in. apply monthly and use saddle soap again before applying more Dubbin.

Hope this Helps.

 

Dubbin has been used since time began. Whilst one manufacturer has used it as a product name (www.dubbin.co.uk) there are many, many products out there which are available.

The army used to use it to waterproof their boots. Horse riders use it to condition the leather in their saddles. Some motorcyclists use it to condition their leathers. Hikers use it on their boots. Lacrosse players use it on their equipment. Dubbin is primarily used to keep leather supple and somewhat waterproof and not as you say, to keep stitching in good condition. It's made from various ingredients, the most common being tallow (animal fat) and bee or paraffin wax.

Thanks for the instructions, but that wasn't what I was asking

Dubbin manufacturers instruct users to pay partiular attention to stitching, but the theory is that the amino acids in the animal fat encourage growth of anerobic bacteria which feed on cellulose structures (like cotton stitching) causing the stitching to prematurely age. The arguement is that synthetic conditioners don't do this.

Does anyone have personal experience?

As I said initially, the laboratory proof is there, but what is hard to find is translation of these results to the "real world" where people have had direct experience of this occurring.

 

I agree with all you have said, however i rode horses professionally for 12 years, and trust me a saddle like boots take incredible punishment.

In real world terms this stuff is used to soften leather, thats why i say use sparingly, if you use too much it softens so much the leather tears. also i know it cotes the stitching and waterproofs it, this is important for boots and saddles as we get wet daily. if you leave Dubbin on leather for say 3 months without use, it will grow a green mould, this is why we always wash of the old and renew.

Also if we store the gear we wash it with saddle soap and then treat it with an oil based leather protector, this also prevents the green mould from forming.
So yes it can rot, but done correctly it won't rot.

 

Lanolin is the go, dubbin is a wax, lanolin is and oil used in Oz.

 

Dubbin is made from tallow, natural wax and OIL.
The waxes commonly used are beeswax, paraffin or canubra.
I used it for 10+ years on my lacrosse stick leathers, and I live in Oz

No more explanations about how to use it, what it's amde of, etc, etc please. Just if you've had a firsthand experience of it rotting natural fibres.

 

Ive heard the same stories (generally from someone trying to sell me an alternative :roll: ). So I have no first hand experience but I decided not to risk it. I assume you are using on your leathers? If you are a bit suss there are lots of good leather treatment products. Any reason it has to be Dubbin?

 

My old man would use it every so often on his boots, they lasted ages and died due to hardcore wear and tear rather than the stitching coming apart.. (though we're talking redbacks so they're the shit anyhow)..

He did give the boots a good clean before hand, and it wasn't all the time.. e.g. polish a handful of times between.. Might have even been more..

 

Roots

I work in the fields of microbiology and chemistry. The answer to "Does dubbin cause threads to rot?" Is yes and no.
Chemically speaking there is nothing in dubbin that will attack threads specifically.
Biologically dubbin helps create an environment that can promote certain threads to rot faster.
Cotton is an organic material that absorbs and wicks very well. The fluid not only wicks along the threads but is absorbed into the cells of cotton. Winter outdoors people have a saying that 'Cotton kills' because a wet spot on cotton clothing will spread to a large part of the article and reduce it's insulating value.
Bacteria and moulds need moisture to grow and replicate. They break down and consume organic materials for their carbon energy. Stitching made of synthetics have no food value and don't rot. Leather is more dense and the fibres don't wick as well as cotton but the same process is going at a slower rate. The tanning process also helps protect leather.
Enter the moisture barriers. . . Dut Dut Dun. Products like dubbin can prevent large amounts of moisture from flooding footwear and soaking socks. Some moisture will enter from the outside but a lot will come from inside the boot. Feet sweat. Once the fibres are moist on the inside dubbin can hold it in for a longer period so the microscopic villains can do their worst.
You can slow the process down by:
Keep applying the moisture barriers on the outside (especially important if you are in wet environments).
Dry the inside of your footwear thoroughly between use. Some people alternate boots every other day.
Use antibacterial foot powder inside the boots. Cuts down on the stink, too.
Change socks every day (with clean ones).

 

I work in the fields of microbiology and chemistry. The answer to "Does dubbin cause threads to rot?" Is yes and no.
Chemically speaking there is nothing in dubbin that will attack threads specifically.
Biologically dubbin helps create an environment that can promote certain threads to rot faster.
Cotton is an organic material that absorbs and wicks very well. The fluid not only wicks along the threads but is absorbed into the cells of cotton. Winter outdoors people have a saying that 'Cotton kills' because a wet spot on cotton clothing will spread to a large part of the article and reduce it's insulating value.
Bacteria and moulds need moisture to grow and replicate. They break down and consume organic materials for their carbon energy. Stitching made of synthetics have no food value and don't rot. Leather is more dense and the fibres don't wick as well as cotton but the same process is going at a slower rate. The tanning process also helps protect leather.
Enter the moisture barriers. . . Dut Dut Dun. Products like dubbin can prevent large amounts of moisture from flooding footwear and soaking socks. Some moisture will enter from the outside but a lot will come from inside the boot. Feet sweat. Once the fibres are moist on the inside dubbin can hold it in for a longer period so the microscopic villains can do their worst.
You can slow the process down by:
Keep applying the moisture barriers on the outside (especially important if you are in wet environments).
Dry the inside of your footwear thoroughly between use. Some people alternate boots ever other day.
Use antibacterial foot powder inside the boots. Cuts down on the stink, too.
Change socks every day (with clean ones).

Thanks for bringing up an 8 year old thread. Very relevant.

 

When you see ofcouncel's Vanilla Ice avatar starring back at you, you know that shit is old.

 

Aren't most modern leathers and other things stitched with synthetic thread? Making rotting a moot point.
I know my leathers have synthetic threads..

 

just fyi: there are zero amino acids in in fat. any fat.