Just spoke to my local Dyno tuner... - Page 2 - Triumph675.Net Forums
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post #11 of 19 Old 11-16-17, 19:57
Plasmablaster
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Originally Posted by beatle View Post
Your bike already makes adjustments to the fueling based on the intake temperature. Why do you think it leans out? Any engine will make less power at higher temperatures as the air is less dense. On my commute into work at cold temperatures (like the 30s) if I nail it in 2nd gear going onto an onramp, the front will almost completely unload. In the summer it will only get a bit light. That's about as unscientific as it gets, but it's normal.
I'm not saying the intake temp sensor is inoperative and of course I understand the principle behind the cooler = denser air (have studied Physics indeed!). Actually if there wasn't any sensor (or if it was inoperative) the opposite would happen: Colder air means actually more air entering the cylinders and if the gas sprayed by the injectors remains the same then the cooler the air, the leaner the mixture. What is happening is actually the opposite: a consistent (and noticeable) change of character of my bike according to temperature - becomes somewhat twitchy, reminiscent of a leanish-running engine when temp goes up.

Of course it's nothing like it used to be - O2 sensor removal, "13.8ing" of the 14.5 a/f cells in the map, and of course remedying the half-fried stator all helped gain a "carburettor-like" throttle response and instead of frustrating it is only occasionally slightly annoying and only at higher temps. At 25 C and below it is a charm, a thing to fall in love with and wouldn't change for any other motorcycle.

So what I'm trying to do is simply remove the last tiny bit of imperfection that has remained.

Thus, if you have any knowledge, my initial question still stands.

Last edited by Plasmablaster; 11-16-17 at 20:05.
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post #12 of 19 Old 11-17-17, 06:48
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Ah, I was going to say if you haven't already disabled / removed your O2 sensor, that's a good way to smooth out the throttle response. I only did it to my street bike a month ago and I wish I did it 2 years ago when I got it.

Not sure how much more can be done for a high-strung sportbike engine to smooth it out. My Bonneville is about as smooth as a bike could be, but it's pretty lazy in comparison to the triple.

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post #13 of 19 Old 11-17-17, 07:06
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Originally Posted by beatle View Post
Ah, I was going to say if you haven't already disabled / removed your O2 sensor, that's a good way to smooth out the throttle response. I only did it to my street bike a month ago and I wish I did it 2 years ago when I got it.
Since you've removed the O2 sensor I strongly suggest opening your maps with TuneECU and converting all 14.5 cells to 13.8 or 13.9. These are all in low throttle & revs range so no way to damage your motor by doing this. You'll see another significant step of improvement in smoothness and your engine will run cooler too, especially in city conditions.

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Originally Posted by beatle View Post
Not sure how much more can be done for a high-strung sportbike engine to smooth it out. My Bonneville is about as smooth as a bike could be, but it's pretty lazy in comparison to the triple.
I'm talking about the resistor on the temp sensor. Have you got any knowledge on what ohms range this variable resistor should be in? Obviously the lowest value should be 0 so as to allow the sensor to send unmodified signal to the ECU for when things are rosy by themselves... but what should the highest value be? The differences in available resistors are in orders of magnitude so I'm pretty sure most of them won't do the work properly and I might even damage my bike if for example the ECU "sees" an extremely high temperature and leans-out the mixture excessively.
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post #14 of 19 Old 11-17-17, 10:11
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I have the Arrow 3-1 tune on it now, and will be loading a new tune on it after the Daytona cams go in. That tune works great on my 2008 with Daytona cams - very smooth. Most cells go no higher than 13.4. That said, I think the AFRs are useless if you've removed the O2 sensor. I believe they're just used as targets for the ECU to hit using fuel trims if the stock map doesn't get it on the first try. With no O2 sensor, there is no feedback to the ECU to adjust the fueling anyway. You might try simply adding a bit of fuel in the twitchy ranges if you've removed the O2 sensor.

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post #15 of 19 Old 11-19-17, 23:08
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Would a booster plug do what you want?

All I ask is a Hinckley triple
And a road to steer her by.
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post #16 of 19 Old 11-20-17, 07:03
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Originally Posted by mark-up View Post
Would a booster plug do what you want?
Ahh that's very interesting, thanks a lot - I never knew such a device existed. I googled it and I'm really tempted although ideally I'd like to have some sort of manual adjustment and this seems to do whatever it thinks is best entirely on its own.

Last edited by Plasmablaster; 11-20-17 at 08:32.
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post #17 of 19 Old 11-20-17, 12:04
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Until I see back-to-back dyno runs, I call bullshit.
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post #18 of 19 Old 11-21-17, 06:44
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Originally Posted by MGFChapin View Post
Until I see back-to-back dyno runs, I call bullshit.
I doubt the effect of the booster plug would show up on the dyno. The guy contradicts himself a bit because in his extensive explanation on how it works he says that it enriches the mixture by 6% (which is quite a lot) across the entirety of the map and his graphs show this mostly improves driveability instead of power.

On a second note I don't think I want it because my problem is way slighter than what this... sledgehammer does. At cooler temps my bike is sublime, it's only just a tad nervous-ish at higher ones, and 6% is too much - I don't want to start fouling my plugs, clogging my valves, blackening my oil etc.
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post #19 of 19 Old 11-21-17, 12:09
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Originally Posted by Plasmablaster View Post
I doubt the effect of the booster plug would show up on the dyno. The guy contradicts himself a bit because in his extensive explanation on how it works he says that it enriches the mixture by 6% (which is quite a lot) across the entirety of the map and his graphs show this mostly improves driveability instead of power.
Yeah, maybe it wouldn't show on a dyno, but you're right, an across-the-board enrichment is dangerous and lazy. The booster plug replaces the air temp sensor and doesn't interface with anything else on the bike, so it really is a "sledgehammer" as you put it. At worst, it'll dilute the oil and eventually blow the motor. At best, the O2 sensor will compensate and make it totally pointless.
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