2013 Daytona 675 stock suspension
Hi, Iíve searched for info but canít find what Iím looking for.
I have a 2013 Daytona 675 ďnonĒ r for track days. Never plan to race it and Iím a novice track rider.
I also have a 2013 street triple ďnonĒ r. I rode it on the track last year. It was a good ride but immediately felt the rear suspension was cruddy and soft especially on the rebound. I decided to put an eBay ďrĒ shock on it for some adjustability but never took it back to the track. The track Iím referencing is rough. This year I rode the Daytona for the 1st time last weekend and found it a much better ride than the street triple. However I found this suspension to be harsh. Not bad like the street triple but just harsh on this rough track.
I know 1st thing I need to do is check and set sag. And I will. (Supposedly this bike was set up already with the previous rider my weight). But I know thatís no excuse especially when Iím complaining about itís harshness. My question is even know it has adjustable preload front an back, compression and rebound, is this ďnonĒ r stock suspension hopeless? Or with proper springs and some tuning will it get me in the ball park without spending a pile on a whole new suspension? I probably wouldnít even mind paying a professional to help me set this up but replacement seems out of the question cost wise because it doubles with some street duty as well. Otherwise I would have just bought a dedicated track bike.
Thoughts? Experiences? Thanks!
I recommend getting it professionally set up at a local suspension shop. Check local track groups to see which ones are good to go.
They will be able to give you a good baseline setup for your weight and make any spring/valving changes they deem necessary. Depending on how long it has been since the suspension was serviced (if ever), it might be a good idea to get that done too.
A lot of my local track events have a local shop there to do track-side setup/changes at a slight discount, and you can go back after a few sessions and talk to them and re-adjust as necessary. They know what they're doing and can really help find the root of any issues and explain the how/why of it all.
I'd wait to drop larger $$ on suspension upgrades until you confirm can't solve your problems on the current setup, especially since you're at a novice pace.
I have the same exact bike and year as you. The oem suspension is more than adequate for track days. You can also use the settings in the manual. Comfort-Standard or Race. It's very easy to adjust. All I did was put heavier fork oil in the front
That Ohlins R shock might be a direct fit to your bike also.
Agree with above. That bike is plenty fast in its current form. Harshness might be due to servicing as mentioned above. Do yourself a favor and email Dave Moss. He will likely give you better info than a local shop with suspension setup. There is also an excellent thread from about a year ago about suspension setup on this forum.
For reference with bike setup, a friend started in novice with a cbr f4i, and with no mods at all, not even rearsets, he rode that bike all the way to the A group. He rides a fully cmra race prepped 675r now and is just a few seconds faster on his 675r when going back to back with the two bikes.
Great advice- thank you. I think one of my track clubs has a ďsuspensionĒ track night. I need to attend that one and in general start asking questions at these track days. Iím also a guy who likes to do his own work but my knowledge may not be robust enough.
Lastly I did get to checking my sag tonight. To my surprise both front and rear seem to have too much? That seems to contradict my harshness complaint?
Iíll try to contact Dave Moss as well.
A good starting point for sag is based on a rule of thumb. It is not gospel. As you get faster your sag likely will not look anything like it does now. Racers do not go by sag numbers or every bike would have a book that has numbers for every rider weight. Actually, I bet most racers have no idea what their sag is.
Since you're riding a 675 we can rule out bad suspension (unless it's faulty). Harshness could be old oil, bad setup of rebound and compression and/or sag, bad tires, messed up geometry, etc. Also, remember sag sets a preload on the spring and in turn changes ride height, which is why when you get sag you need to be sure the front and rear of the bike still is within heights that keep the proper geometry. Sometimes you will need to set the fork in the triple to another position to have the correct suspension travel and still have good geometry. Sag(set using spring preload) does not change the spring rate. 0.9 is a 0.9 no matter what the sag is set to.
Sag is set primarily to give you maximum suspension travel. The rule of thumb is usually about 2/3 left of suspension travel when you are sitting on the bike with full gear. Since most sport bikes have about the same length fork travel, the sag number is born.
I suggest you put a ziptie around one of the forks, and if you can, on the shaft of the rear spring. You generally want the fork/spring to compress as much as possible on your hardest braking without bottoming, but getting close. Not panic braking but controlled braking.
Most people setup their bikes way too stiff because that's what most people think high performance means. Hence why so many modified cars have such bad suspension setups, but that's another story for another day.
Also check the rebound and compression of your forks and rear shock. Keep a notebook and write down all settings. Also note how the bike feels and how the tires look. Make one change at a time and note the difference. You will learn pretty quickly how to adjust the suspension based on feel and tire wear.
Alright, thanks for the post. It generates a couple questions. For starters the zip tie idea is good and I will try that. Tonight I backed the clickers out to both ends too see where they are at. Generally they are all a little on the stiffer side. Not meaning they are too hard (but yet maybe) but all were like 8 clicks off full hard of say 20 for example. (Not actual numbers).
Geometry. How does one know if that is right? Iíve never heard of ďnumbersĒ regarding this. How would you know if itís off?
Iíd like to know about how the suspension settings affects tire wear?
Geometry is based on numbers but every bike is different. For example changing the tire brand changes tire diameter and that change will likely change how the bike feels and responds to inputs. Dave is very good with this type of information and can tell you where to start with fork height and all suspension settings to give you a good baseline. The other way is to find a totally stock unmolested bike and measure the front and rear height from the ground, etc., or find a fast racer (there are some on this forum) who has your model bike and ask questions about his/her setup, tire selection, etc.
Tire wear is very dependent on suspension settings and you can see if say you have too much or too little damping, wrong air pressure, etc., by looking at the tire. This is quite obvious when running on the track and if you have a good tire guy he can tell you what's what. If not then send Dave some pics and he will give you recommendations. Also, do your own research online. Life at lean has a pretty good starter page on tire wear.
Thanks again for your reply. I contacted Dave a couple days ago but havenít heard back. Funny you mentioned life at lean. I just recently discovered their site and have started to study up. Daveís site as well seem to have some good vids and info. Just have to take some time to watch them and take notes.
I copied this from an online magazine, forget which one. 2013 Daytona (std), average weight rider. I'm assuming it's for street riding, but I don't know for sure.
Preload 4 lines showing
Rebound 8 clicks out
HS comp 3 turns out
LS comp 10 clicks out
Preload 8mm thread showing
Rebound 9 clicks out
HS comp 3 turns out
LS 15 clicks out
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