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Cam Chain Slap - <1 from end of warranty

6K views 24 replies 6 participants last post by  airrix 
#1 ·
Hello fellow 675er's

I recently purchased my 14' Striple and have been doing some much needed maintenance and cleaning to get it back up to snuff. I've now completed everything but started noticing cam chain slap.

I'm quite aware that the CCT is far from ideal in design on these bikes and being a week from the end of my warranty, I'm quite worried. Although I hear the normal clatter of valves/injectors on cold startup (with a hint of chain slap), I can easily reproduce audible chain slap when in high gear/low rpm with a generous dose of throttle (right before the growl overpowers all sounds).

I'll be visiting the local dealership, however I'm concerned that they'll shrug it off as being "normal". What course of action do you suggest I take?

Bike has ~12600km/7800miles.
 
#4 ·
The chain tensioner on the newer bikes is not a weak point. Only on the older spring only tensioned bikes. The newer ones are spring and hydraulic and have a a robust ratcheting mechanism. The old unit was a very fine narrow ratchet with a small diameter overly long spring that would eventually overlap itself and the ratchet teeth would wear.

Don't worry about it it ride it.
 
#5 ·
Thanks for your input everyone.

I visited a dealership this morning, and they confirmed my prognosis.
They made a claim with Triumph to replace the tensioner, and although I would have expected that they would replace the chain and guides as well, I'm pleased.

Will update once I get the response from Triumph.
 
#7 ·
I had the CCT replace on mine (Triple R 2012 model) on Monday under warranty, and noticed an immediate reduction in the noise from the engine. A bit clattery on start-up, after about 30 seconds it dies down and all I can hear now is a bit of valve tick. I did ask them to put a manual one on but they replace like for like so I got an hydraulic one.

Apparently the one that they took out had seized completely. Not good...
 
#8 ·
That's pretty far out your warranty coverage period, how did you manage to get them to do that?

As for my bike, the CCT was replaced. My dealer wasn't very communicative with me as to the condition of the old one.
Anyways it is still a bit louder than I would have hoped even when warm but it seems that the slapping sound is gone.

I haven't ridden since I got home from the service, I will start and warm it up tonight... I'll assess then and report back.
 
#10 ·
So I attempted to replace the hydraulic cam tensioner (OEM) with the APE manual tensioner this morning. Here is what I did (I have a 2012 Street Triple for reference):

Bought this



Recover the cover and adjusted to TDC. A couple of things I noticed
1. There is a little damage from the chain rubbing against the bike.


2. As I was going to wedge a socket so that I can hold tension for the cam chain, I noticed a metal brace. I have never seen this in the past write ups or tutorials. Anyone else have this?


Then I removed the OEM Cam tensioner and compared it to the APE. The adjustment length are very different. The OEM one is a bit longer even when pushed all the way in. Here is a comparison.



I was concern about this so rather than using the APE manual tensioner, I've put the OEM back in. As I put the OEM back in, I noticed that it was a bit stiffer but I assume it's auto adjusting.

So questions:
1. Should I keep with the OEM cam tensioner? Or should I use the APE? If it's the latter, should I be concern about the adjustment length being shorter?
 
#11 ·
That metal is just the chain guide it's normal. The length is only important up to the point that the tensioner is long enough to apply tension to chain.

No need to find TDC doing this. However you're at a point now that I don't know if your chain has slipped or not. You can not remove the tensioner without wedging something behind the guide first. Doing so allows the chain to become loose and the cams will rotate regardless of what position you have the crank in.

At this point you need to pull the cam cover and check the cam timing. Do not attempt to start or rotate the motor over until you do.

While you're there you can measure cam chain stretch. I suspect your chain is very stretched.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Before removing the OEM tensioner, I placed a socket between the metal brace/guide and also at the lower portion, sandwiching the chain to the sprocket (I hope that make sense). When putting back the OEM tenioner, I notice the sockets were loose when pulling them out, so I assume the tensioner had put more pressure on the cam chain. So I wasn't concern about the chain slip.

I actually did start up the bike. Took a bit more to crank but the bike started up fine.

Now I'm more concern about my chain being worn out. Is there anyway to measure that?

Curious what made you think that the chain has slipped? Was it my omission in the original post about not wedging something between the chain to put pressure?

I'm at a lost. I should have the right part according to APE's site - http://aperaceparts.com/triumph.html. Noticed that there might be a length variation for the screw, so I emailed APE to see if they recommend a longer screw.
 
#15 ·
As I said the length is fine. All it needs to do is apply tension on the chain. If the chain is stretched beyond what it can apply tension to then the chain is done. The hydraulic tensioner has a spring as well and what you were comparing was it fully extended. The chain would be completely worn out long before that tensioner is fully extended.
 
#16 ·
After reading this, I think you are right. So I went and checked the manual about how to reset the tension on the hydraulic tensioner. The picture below with the read arrow is how it should look like



Well.. I cannot push back the plunger because the resister ring and snap ring will not hold it in place. I assume the rings are worn out causing the hydraulic tensioner to be full extended. And as a result of that, I think my cam chain have been over stretched for a while and now needs replacing. doh!

I had my valve checked at 16k miles and everything was in spec. Now I have 20k miles.

Lesson learn: REPLACE THE HYDRAULIC TENSIONER WITH A MANUAL ONE.
 
#18 ·
Just a little update on my CCT situation.

I rode into work this morning (first ride after coming home from the dealer), and the noise is still there.

I called Triumph Corporate and they said call the dealer. Dealer said we can open it but if we find nothing then we're charging you for our time. It's a really funny response from them because they admit that the sound is abnormal but say "if we find nothing"... They're a bunch of parts-changers, no real mechanics.

I don't know what to do at this point... Any suggestions?
 
#20 ·
'12 Striple Owner here.

I too was concerned about the length of the manual tensioner vs the hydraulic one. I took it to the shop and they too had the same concerns. However my bike was making this really bad metal on metal rubbing noise.

I ended up replacing Cam Chain + Guides.

After that they were able to install the manual one. I will state your hydraulic one was not extended as much as mine(it was fully extended). The bike makes weird noises still. I am pretty sure it has an exhaust leak that is causing more weird sounds. Once I get the time I am having the pipes cross sections re welded.
 
#21 ·
'12 Striple Owner here.

I too was concerned about the length of the manual tensioner vs the hydraulic one. I took it to the shop and they too had the same concerns. However my bike was making this really bad metal on metal rubbing noise.

I ended up replacing Cam Chain + Guides.

After that they were able to install the manual one. I will state your hydraulic one was not extended as much as mine(it was fully extended). The bike makes weird noises still. I am pretty sure it has an exhaust leak that is causing more weird sounds. Once I get the time I am having the pipes cross sections re welded.
Aw dude! Thanks for the confirmation.

I ordered some parts yesterday with the intension to replace the cam chain. While I'm at it check the valves and check out the spark plugs. I didn't order the chain guides though. Checked mine like 3 times it it seems to in order.

Wish me luck on installing it. :smile2:
 
#22 ·
That's exactly what I will do as well, when I come up to the 20km service... Might as well since everything will be cracked open anyways.

Just seems odd that such a well put-together and performing motorcycle would have such a stupid cam chain/CCT/engine casing design.
 
#23 ·
These aren't common failures. The design is sound. As with anything there is a very small percentage of failure rate. If there was even a few percent failure rate these boards would be filled with new members complaining. As with anything negative the Internet is full that and very few take the time to say that they don't have a problem.

That doesn't mean your problem isn't any less important it's just shitty luck.
 
#24 ·
Agreed MacBandit but I think it's a little more common then most people realize.

Nonetheless, in my searches, I stumbled across a post on this forum from a person with the same problem. Another member suggested to warm the bike up and do a full throttle run in second to redline and right before hitting the limiter to chop the throttle off completely. He mentioned it should help the CCT click to the next position by spiking the oil pressure and that would provide enough tension to attenuate the noise.

I completed multiple runs as described and it seems to have had the desired effect. While the bike isn't as quiet as I would have expected, the chain-slap has reduced to an "acceptable" level.

I visited another dealer shortly thereafter which also agreed that the noise is now considered "normal". I will still be replacing the chain and guides at the 20K kms service just to be safe!
 
#25 ·
Agreed MacBandit but I think it's a little more common then most people realize.

Nonetheless, in my searches, I stumbled across a post on this forum from a person with the same problem. Another member suggested to warm the bike up and do a full throttle run in second to redline and right before hitting the limiter to chop the throttle off completely. He mentioned it should help the CCT click to the next position by spiking the oil pressure and that would provide enough tension to attenuate the noise.

I completed multiple runs as described and it seems to have had the desired effect. While the bike isn't as quiet as I would have expected, the chain-slap has reduced to an "acceptable" level.

I visited another dealer shortly thereafter which also agreed that the noise is now considered "normal". I will still be replacing the chain and guides at the 20K kms service just to be safe!
OH! thanks for this tip.

For my cause, it turned out that the cam chain was loose or worn out. I replaced it and things seem good now.
 
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