R suspension bottom of the barrel?

[Shamrock]

Originally Posted by jdgun_13

It is just off the bottom of the barrel for ohlins and brembo...

SORRY!

Production bikes dont use top shelf anything!.

YES! Somebody gets it!

[f16falcon]

I don't get the logic of saying only a pro can benifit from advanced suspension. That makes no sense to me. Do we understand what suspension does? Consider a bike with NO suspension compared to one with average suspension. Do you need to be a pro to benefit from the average suspension? No, because simply riding the bike normally, you will feel unstable with no shocks.

Suspension helps keep the tire on the ground and therefore adds more grip. Why do you need to be a pro to benifit? People crash many times because they exceed grip. A novice will exceed grip faster than a pro if both are riding normally, so the novice would be better off with better suspension. The pro, who is better at managing his grip, will not need as much. So imagine a noob with top of the line suspension who goes into a turn too hot. He leans too much because of bad body positioning. Would the extra stability from superior suspension not benefit this noob?

Are you guys saying rather that any high end suspension with give just about the same level of grip and stability for normal riding? Perhaps the advantages of the higher end suspension are things like adjustability(which the noob will not know how to use) and it's performance at it's limits which a noob which never get close too?

[DecepticonDon]

Originally Posted by f16falcon

I don't get the logic of saying only a pro can benifit from advanced suspension. That makes no sense to me. Do we understand what suspension does? Consider a bike with NO suspension compared to one with average suspension. Do you need to be a pro to benefit from the average suspension? No, because simply riding the bike normally, you will feel unstable with no shocks.

Suspension helps keep the tire on the ground and therefore adds more grip. Why do you need to be a pro to benifit? People crash many times because they exceed grip. A novice will exceed grip faster than a pro if both are riding normally, so the novice would be better off with better suspension. The pro, who is better at managing his grip, will not need as much. So imagine a noob with top of the line suspension who goes into a turn too hot. He leans too much because of bad body positioning. Would the extra stability from superior suspension not benefit this noob?

Are you guys saying rather that any high end suspension with give just about the same level of grip and stability for normal riding? Perhaps the advantages of the higher end suspension are things like adjustability(which the noob will not know how to use) and it's performance at it's limits which a noob which never get close too?

The newb exceeding his available grip would be doing so because he doesn't know the limit of grip, nor can he understand the feedback from his tires and suspension.

What do you consider normal riding, chicken strip annihilating or commuting?

[Dave73]

This is how it works:

Honda, Suzuki, Triumph, etc call up Showa, Kayaba, Ohlins, etc and say " Hey, we want to use your stuff. We are going to buy eleventy sets of them...we want hootus valves, unobtanium coatings, and super widgets...how much will that cost?" Showa, Kayaba, and Ohlins gives their price with those specs in mind. If Honda, Suzuki, Triumph, etc like it then they buy it. If not, they change the specs to suit their needs or to achieve their target price point.

[Red October]

Originally Posted by f16falcon

Suspension helps keep the tire on the ground and therefore adds more grip. Why do you need to be a pro to benifit? People crash many times because they exceed grip. A novice will exceed grip faster than a pro if both are riding normally, so the novice would be better off with better suspension.

If novice exceeds the grip it's likely due to excessive lean angle which is driven by bad BP...as you point out below. In this case higher end suspension wouldn't save them anyway.

The pro, who is better at managing his grip, will not need as much. So imagine a noob with top of the line suspension who goes into a turn too hot. He leans too much because of bad body positioning. Would the extra stability from superior suspension not benefit this noob?

Just to pull a number out of air...in 90% of the cases the answer is no?

Are you guys saying rather that any high end suspension with give just about the same level of grip and stability for normal riding?

Yes

Perhaps the advantages of the higher end suspension are things like adjustability(which the noob will not know how to use) and it's performance at it's limits which a noob which never get close too?

Yes to both, and BETTER adjustability.

Consider your average track day noob/beginner level rider which, honestly, is pretty good equivalent to "normal riding".
Do they feel difference in suspension or tire grip given the times they run and lean angles which probably do not exceed 45 deg? Not bloody likely.

[Dave73]

Part of becoming a faster rider is learning the limits of your equipment. As far as a noob needing upgraded stuff... If they haven't exceeded the capability of the base model equipment (which is pretty good), why would they need something better?

I have seen a few 675Rs at the track and haven't been wowed by an operator yet...

[Jstu202]

Originally Posted by Dave73

I have seen a few 675Rs at the track and haven't been wowed by an operator yet...

Prepare to be wowed..

(my R is still waiting for its full exhaust.. haven't even put a mile on it yet haha)

[Dave73]

Oh, I'm sure there are some fast guys with'em... just they seem to be in the minority from what I've seen so far.

[shouldnthave]

Originally Posted by Dave73

Oh, I'm sure there are some fast guys with'em... just they seem to be in the minority from what I've seen so far.

I know a few...


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